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Thread: Thoughts on the new combat system

  1. #1

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    Thoughts on the new combat system

    is this some kind of joke? or just a big FU to all the guide makers?
    the combat system is just something to in-depth in the game to change now, its the kind of thing you change during beta phases
    with all the changes in the troops, all the guides will become useless, are you joking with our time? because players like me lost many hours making guides for the community

    about all the changes, i agree with removing weapons from loot and lowering the cost of production of weapons and troops, but not changing troops attributes

    the devs shouldnt be wasting their time on stupidity like this (like when we spent time making guides), instead they should just develop content thats actually wanted by the players (like pvp), and more important, fix the damn broken features

  2. #2

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    If the system implements new features that makes the game more fair to the player I personally am welcome to it. Moreover, as you said, it is going to give importance to the weapon productions, but the balancing they proposed, as suggested, should be reseen.

    However, about the guides, this is true, indeed, that most of the guides will become useless, but we still will have a base to build the new ones (positions will be the same, if some specifics such as splash damage on some units would be added it may be better for some point of view) (think about having cannoneers with splash damage... ).

    The current system, anyway, should be reseen, from some point of view is insanely fair (try defeating bandits or the first camps in roaring bulls (which requires 10-15 recruits each)) but, on the other hand, it is insanely unfair in many other point of views (where the "pc" has some too powerful units).

    Maybe a clever splash damage assignment will sove everything?

  3. #3

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    I will say this: if you implement such a system, be prepared to have a way to delete accounts that never spent money and have not logged in for a year or more. This would be needed to refresh the population of many servers that will have a LOT of elder players quitting.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Draconus2004 View Post
    I will say this: if you implement such a system, be prepared to have a way to delete accounts that never spent money and have not logged in for a year or more. This would be needed to refresh the population of many servers that will have a LOT of elder players quitting.
    This system is not going to be implemented in such a way, many things needs to be fixed, but I think the whole idea of having more bonuses is good. Also, the idea of making some buildings more useful is good too.

  5. #5

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    However, about the guides, this is true, indeed, that most of the guides will become useless, but we still will have a base to build the new ones (positions will be the same, if some specifics such as splash damage on some units would be added it may be better for some point of view) (think about having cannoneers with splash damage... ).
    Guess you missed this then...

    Lastly, here is a short overview about what hasnt been changed yet, but is currently still being evaluated for possible adjustments:
    •General adventure balancing (unit deployment and camp positions)
    •Cavalry costs
    •Unit beer costs
    •Adventure rewards besides weapon removal
    •Balancing of Generals
    I don't understand The old combat system and so I'm lost even before I start with the new one. Words like hit points, splash damage, initiative I understand as words but in calculating combat forget it, sounds to much like work than gaming for me. I get by in this game thanks to the simulators and the great guide writers like Tage and Evil_J. If I were them I'd be feeling pretty un appreciated right now, whether the Devs recognise what this part of the community has given to the game or not, we the players DO, Big time
    I'm sure some guide writers will continue to mitigate whatever BB throws at the game, some will give up, understandably and be replaced by new writers not yet worn down by the ineptitude of the development team. But what happens 6mnths down the line when their new balancing , unbalances another part of the game or everybody stops doing particular addys because the new sums don't add up.
    Please use a bit of common sense, make adjustments to the loot tables by all means, even tweek the resource cost of troop production if you have too. Make three variations of each adventure, simply changing the troop make up of several camps and randomise there delivery to players.
    Change the multiplayer loot system and link the overall loot to the xp that each player gains. These are just some simple changes that would move the game into a more `balanced' era, without the need to change the whole established combat system. The devs could then use the time saved to de bug the game properly and devise great events....that work.
    Please, Please give us a clean test island and just mail us extra resources If this is a bug report: Win7, Firefox 30.0 / IE 11.0.9600.17239, flash 14.0.0.176 BST UK, time and date 15mins before posting

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by Larili View Post
    Guess you missed this then...



    I don't understand The old combat system and so I'm lost even before I start with the new one. Words like hit points, splash damage, initiative I understand as words but in calculating combat forget it, sounds to much like work than gaming for me. I get by in this game thanks to the simulators and the great guide writers like Tage and Evil_J. If I were them I'd be feeling pretty un appreciated right now, whether the Devs recognise what this part of the community has given to the game or not, we the players DO, Big time
    I'm sure some guide writers will continue to mitigate whatever BB throws at the game, some will give up, understandably and be replaced by new writers not yet worn down by the ineptitude of the development team. But what happens 6mnths down the line when their new balancing , unbalances another part of the game or everybody stops doing particular addys because the new sums don't add up.
    Please use a bit of common sense, make adjustments to the loot tables by all means, even tweek the resource cost of troop production if you have too. Make three variations of each adventure, simply changing the troop make up of several camps and randomise there delivery to players.
    Change the multiplayer loot system and link the overall loot to the xp that each player gains. These are just some simple changes that would move the game into a more `balanced' era, without the need to change the whole established combat system. The devs could then use the time saved to de bug the game properly and devise great events....that work.
    Actually, with the current system, you can kindly predict some battles way more than before, I've made some guides too and I've learnt many things both from tage and EvilJ (mostly EvilJ for positions and tricks, Tage for specific blocks analysis).

    The big idea, to me, is that being able to study your own blocks is not so complex (you just need to practice), and since blocking is not necessary, you may play your game in your own way without blocking (many are doing this, and you're free to do that too).

    I would say that players like Tage, Evilj, PrincessAlly, Polymer, Killste and so on will always need a huge thanks from the whole community: every of them provided valuable guides and by following these guides you can easily understand:

    A) How to place generals.
    B) How to setup them.
    C) How to solve harder situations.

    If you can't do that by yourself, try to learn it, it's part of the game.

    If you don't want to learn it, procede without blocking, that's it.

    The old material will never be useless, at least to me.

    I think someone is being too hostile to this new system, I totally agree that many rebalancing still need to be done, but the whole idea of allowing the player (YOU), to be able to face in a newer ways some situations is not that bad and, moreover, giving importance to buildings that never had importance is a good point, because most of the players are actually farming and knows nothing of the game.

    Giving splash damage to all the units is quite eccessive (at least to me), but having some of them with splash damage will allow the player to drastically reduce losses in some situation by finding some newer ways to play the game, and not to copy it.

    Players who had done an extremely good job making the guides for the adventures can make an extremely better job by making a tutorial on how to face an adventure. Meanwhile, it will soon not become a work, for you, but a game, because if you like the game itself you will find the motivation to learn how it works, and that's when funny things happens: when you beat the game without needing to google a thousand guides and complain that a block you saw didn't work.

    And guess what? people still complains about C16 in the sons of the little tailor of evilj. How bad.
    Last edited by bri0sheje; 02.09.14 at 20:17.

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by Larili View Post
    I get by in this game thanks to the simulators and the great guide writers like Tage and Evil_J. If I were them I'd be feeling pretty un appreciated right now, whether the Devs recognise what this part of the community has given to the game or not, we the players DO, Big time
    Thanks mate! Neither of us are happy campers at the moment.
    Changing all the guides after this would be quite a lot more to do than to update them for the new pathing two years ago or for the odd new general once a year.
    A lot depends on how soon Asipak and Ullrich can update their simulators.
    However, almost all my blocks rely on a DOS simulator made by Andelar. And he isn't active anymore, hasn't been for quite a while.
    Reoptimising all the blocks without his tool is nothing I look forward to, not even sure I want to...

  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by bri0sheje View Post
    Players who had done an extremely good job making the guides for the adventures can make an extremely better job by making a tutorial on how to face an adventure. Meanwhile, it will soon not become a work, for you, but a game, because if you like the game itself you will find the motivation to learn how it works, and that's when funny things happens: when you beat the game without needing to google a thousand guides and complain that a block you saw didn't work.
    I tried that once. Nobody read it because everyone took the easy way out and guides are readily available for every adventure and troop combination. Nobody cares how the combat system works, and nobody cares to learn.

    On reflection, I think that's why this entire change of the combat system is doomed to failure with 75% of the current playerbase. They don't understand what's been done because they didn't understand it before, and they will just leave.

    So long as new players come in and are faced with the new combat system from the get go, then nobody will miss that 75%.

  9. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tage View Post
    Thanks mate! Neither of us are happy campers at the moment.
    Changing all the guides after this would be quite a lot more to do than to update them for the new pathing two years ago or for the odd new general once a year.
    A lot depends on how soon Asipak and Ullrich can update their simulators.
    However, almost all my blocks rely on a DOS simulator made by Andelar. And he isn't active anymore, hasn't been for quite a while.
    Reoptimising all the blocks without his tool is nothing I look forward to, not even sure I want to...
    Tage and Evil_J: Your guides are well made. I hope you will continue on to help players...

  10. #10

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    Um just a note - new system is much easier to model by hand. For instance - anytime they throw fire dancers at me without first strike troops protecting them, i simply will use a longbow sac wave.

    87 longbows v. 100 cultist, 100 fire dancers (probably can do less, and then just use first strike to wipe out the rest of the camp).

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